Process, Process, Process [Monday Meeting Notes]

PUGMYoshaPugStyleSheetMediumHi, everyone! I’m Eddy Webb. I’m a freelance developer, consultant, and occasional Rich Thomas stand-in. Rich and his family are on vacation in San Diego, Seattle, Sacramento… someplace beginning with S. (Thanks for clapping, one person in the audience. That joke was for you.) Right now, I’m in the middle of a number of projects at various states. Lore of the Clans is wrapping up, Pugmire is in the middle of development, and new books (such as Lore of the Bloodlines) are just starting. So it’s a good time to talk about the process of making products.

Pitch. Every product starts with a pitch. For the Lore of the Clans stretch goal products, it was a quick exchange of emails to talk over what would make sense for the Kickstarter campaign. I had pitched Lore of the Bloodlines previously, but we all agreed it wasn’t a strong enough book compared to others that were accepted (which I can’t go into – NDA ninjas and all that). But it made sense as a Kickstarter goal. Other projects, like Pugmire, involved a lengthy document covering what the product is like, what it could do for Onyx Path, and so on. So there isn’t a “standard pitch process” – it really depends on the situation.

Outline. Next, the developer writes up an outline to detail the scope and structure of the product, to make sure everyone is on the same page. For example, I need to work on the outline for Lore of the Bloodlines soon. I have a rough idea of what the book will look like, but each bloodline will be covered in about 5,000 words, which is a little less than half the size of each of the Clan chapters in Lore of the Clans. I think I have a way of handling it, but I may also need to argue for a slightly higher wordcount budget – it’s something I haven’t had the chance to really think through. I also have to do a lot of initial research to sort out what direction I want the book to go in. Every book has its own challenges and limitations, and the outline (ideally) sorts those challenges out.

Production and Art. This is the bulk of the “making the book” phase. Hiring writers, artists, and editors happens here, and the developer and the art director work with them to make sure the words and the art are all going in the right direction. That’s the phase I’m in with Pugmire right now, although it’s early development: I have some playtest data that I need to finish compiling, rewrite the core system, and sort out what will go into the first playtest product. (Weirdly, this actually requires another outlining phase, because the alpha playtest ended up being its own “product.”) I’m also working with Rich and Mike on some initial art pieces to help get the right look and feel for the world. For some books, this is a very straightforward phase – implement the outline and make sure it’s on track – but the more central or complex the product is, the more that this phase can take different and exciting directions.

I’m certainly deep in the “different and exciting” direction right now.

Proofing. Once the various pieces are done, “Mirthful” Mike or one of his freelance layout people puts everything together. Once that’s all done, the developer looks over the book to make sure everything looks right and there aren’t any errors. I did a proof of what we currently have for Lore of the Clans online recently, and now it’s up on YouTube (start at the 14:00 mark, since Ian and I put things up early and I was waiting for viewers to arrive). It’s a quick overview of a longer process, but I do talk through some of the various things I look for when proofing a book. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xd5kOyogO7E

Drink. It isn’t part of the process, but I try to celebrate each product when it’s done, if I can. Sometimes it’s just a beer at home, but other times I go out for a nice dinner or get myself something as a gift. But I think it’s important to remind myself that I helped get something out the door.

That’s a very quick, high-level look at how a product starts from an idea and ends up as something for you to read and play. It’s not a rigid checklist with defined timetables, but more of an organic growth that each team approaches in different ways.

 

Announcements

Gen Con

Our booth number is #1103. Also, our lovely Marketing person, Monica, asked me to pass this along, since it goes live today!

Along with the Exhibit Hall Map’s debut, the release of the Gen Con Event Catalog is one of the most anticipated days of the gamer year. Good news! It will be live and searchable on Monday, May 11. This will give you approximately one week to explore it and create your 2015 Wish List. Along with the debut of the catalog, you can begin creating your Wish Lists on Monday for the opening of Event Registration on Sunday, May 17 at noon (Eastern).

DriveThruRPG Sales

World of Darkness: Mirrors sale has one day left: [Edit: Sale is over, but you can still get the PDFs!]

God-Machine Anthology Sale has one day left: [Edit: Sale is over, but you can still get the PDF!]

 

Production (from Rose!)

First Draft

WtF The Pack

MtC Anthology

Dark Eras expansions

Scarred Lands Player’s Guide: Ghelspad

Ex Realm

Ex Dragon-Blooded

Pugmire Gen Con book

CtL anthology

Ex3 Novel (Forbeck)

MtAs Book of Secrets

MtAs M20 Anthology”

 

Redlines

WtA Employee Indoctrination Handbook

WoD Hurt Locker

CtL 2e

Beckett’s Jyhad Diary

MtC Rio

WtA Changing Ways

WtO Wr20 core

 

Second Draft

VtR Secrets of the Covenants

Ex Arms of the Chosen

MtAw 2e core

VtM Ghouls

WoD nWoD 2e core

 

Development

WtA Shattered Dreams

DtD Storytelller’s Guide

Demon Translation Guide

PtC 2e core

 

Editing

VtM Tal’Mahe’Ra/Black Hand

VtM Ghouls

MtAs How Do You DO That?

 

Art Direction (from Mike!)

In Art Direction

M20 How Do You Do That – Finals should start be all in this week.

Dreams of Avarice – Artnotes going out to artist. Assembling some elements.

Beast – Finals are starting to roll in.

Red List – KMJ working on art. I think he’s gotten five done… all looking good.

NWoD 2 – Artists assembled and notes going out. Lost power for a chunk of my Friday, so running a little behind.

 

In Layout

Gen Con Stuff – Brochure is pretty much as far as I can get it until text is in. Trying to get the booth shirt done and resolved this week.

 

Proofing

M20 – Corrections and page refs fill in followed by some final layout tweaks. This will take up the bulk of my week, if not all of it. Once that is all done and I’m happy with the final pdf, I’ll send it over to CCP for approval…

M20 Screen – Proofing with Phil.

Red List – In proofing.

Art of CB – Awaiting the Rich seal of approval.

 

At Press (on Drivethru… or whatever)

BotW 20 – Should have shipped out to the fulfillment house on Friday…

Ex 3 Anthology – Awaiting updated text file.

Sothis Ascends – Awaiting the proof copy of Sothis Standard.

 

Special

Dark Eras – Holding pattern.

V20 Lore of the Clans – Holding pattern for appendices.

Beast Within Revised Layout – Awaiting approval, then I’ll update the PDF and add PoD and Epub.

VDA20 – Indexing.

Wraith 20 – Awaiting art notes for the book. All the logos from Cobb are in.

 

EDIT FROM EDDY: I didn’t receive any word on Exalted 3rd. As such, I assume it’s in the same state as last week.

Reason to Drink: On May 11, 1927, the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences was founded. Yesterday, I saw Avengers: Age of Ultron for the second time.


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57 responses to “Process, Process, Process [Monday Meeting Notes]”

  1. jason Avatar
    jason

    OMG Pugmire looks awesome. I love the artwork. Sign me up when it gets out, as I will be making a character based off of daddy’s shadow, my glorified lap dog who is a 90 pound female 3 year old black lab that I have had since she was 6 weeks old.

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      I’m glad you’re liking the direction of Pugmire! 🙂

  2. Phaolan Avatar
    Phaolan

    I was NOT that one person clapping… More that dolt who, on the drive home, started laughing so hard that when the rozzers pulled me over, I was STILL laughing and, uh, wound up in the poke for it? So yeah, funny stuff Eddy!

    As for the content, I always appreciate these little peeks behind the curtain.

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      Glad someone got it. 😉

  3. César Avatar
    César

    And Exalted 3e?

    1. Trolly McTrollerson Avatar
      Trolly McTrollerson

      They discovered a fundamental flaw in the system and it has been returned to the devs.

      Release date is anticipated in 2047.

      I have put a clause in my will to leave the physical book to my children.

      1. Eddy Webb Avatar

        Ha! It’s not true, but it is funny. 🙂

        1. Trolly McTrollerson Avatar
          Trolly McTrollerson

          I figured funny was better than acerbic and sad. 😀

  4. Sionathan Avatar
    Sionathan

    Looks like Ex3 dropped off the list. Does that means it’s fallen down again and maybe it can’t get up?

  5. JamesF Avatar
    JamesF

    Any word on Exalted 3e and when the Kickstarter for Beast is going to be

  6. Eddy Webb Avatar

    I didn’t receive any word on Exalted 3rd. I assume it’s in the same state as it was last week. I’ll update the blog accordingly.

  7. Aiden Avatar
    Aiden

    I really do appreciate these looks at the process. And the celebratory aspect!

    Also really excited to see more progress on Beast: the Primordial.

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      Glad some people find the nuts-and-bolts of process interesting. 🙂

  8. Unsilent Majority Avatar
    Unsilent Majority

    Let’s hope that this week or next has some new releases, be it Wednesday or Friday!

    : )

  9. itsthatperson Avatar
    itsthatperson

    So… What’s WtF: The Pack? Is it a character set or something?

    1. Stew Avatar
      Stew

      Nope. Full new book. More soon.

  10. Full Time GM Avatar
    Full Time GM

    I’m so excited for Mage20 I started rereading the Ascension Stortyeller’s Handbook. Can’t wait to start blowing my players’ minds with the new stuff.

    Looking forward to attending GenCon. The booth is often fun and I’m going to actually try and make it to some events this year.

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      I’m looking forward to Gen Con as well!

  11. DR.Dre Avatar
    DR.Dre

    Dammit Eddy! your joke made me Miss Rose and the Doctor!

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      I’m still a little shocked it was ten years ago.

  12. jason Avatar
    jason

    Yes, we are sooooo close to m20. It is so close I would assume we can all taste it..

    1. Unsilent Majority Avatar
      Unsilent Majority

      What does it taste like?

      1. MagisterCrow Avatar
        MagisterCrow

        Clearly, we need to start building consensus.

      2. Greyskull Avatar
        Greyskull

        Obviously it tastes like chicken…

  13. PrimalFlame Avatar
    PrimalFlame

    Two questions:

    Lore of the Bloodlines has a gargoyle section. Any chance we get more gargoyle rituals?

    When are we supposed to have more new Koldunism krainas?

    Thanks for all the hard work guys, and all the attention.

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      I haven’t planned out the Gargoyle section. It’s not off the table, but I won’t confirm that.

      We covered koldunism in RItes of the Blood, and I don’t think there’s any books coming down the pipe soon that will add more to it, aside from what’s already in Dark Ages. Sorry!

  14. Austin Loomis Avatar
    Austin Loomis

    Actually, Rich’s vacation ought to be in someplace beginning with T.

    Also, Ghouls is listed as in both second draft and editing, and Red List in both art direction and proofing. Is this working as intended?

    1. chaney_insaney Avatar
      chaney_insaney

      The text for Red List made it through editing quicker than usual… and since I know where all the art goes, I went ahead and did the layout and sent that off to be proofed.

      The artwork is still in progress (I think KMJ is about half way through the 13 fulls), which is why it is also listed in Art Direction.

      Actually happens every now and then… Heirs to Hell and Seattle pretty much wound up going the same way.

  15. blackheartz Avatar
    blackheartz

    Is WtF The Pack the first supplement for the 2nd edition??

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      I believe so, yes.

    2. Stew Avatar
      Stew

      Yup. I’ll be putting up open dev notes in a few weeks once I a) start getting drafts and b) clear a couple of other books to new stages.

  16. samcwic Avatar
    samcwic

    How are Trinity, Scion, and Sardonyx coming along? I didn’t see them mentioned above.

    1. Neall Avatar
      Neall

      They’re kind of off the normal track of development.

      Trinity is in a bit of a holding pattern right now while we build the Sardonyx open dev variant and integrate internal feedback (which is where Sardonyx is too).

      Scion is currently in pre-outline brainstorming, which sort of belies the fact that a bunch of systems have been built and prototyped in Sardonyx.

      1. samcwic Avatar
        samcwic

        Thank you. I kind of figured that the games were waiting on the Sardonyx system, so that was the one I was most curious about.

      2. ManBearPig Avatar
        ManBearPig

        Would you kindly dumb this down for me? What exactly goes into an open dev variant and how does one generate internal feedback?

  17. Aise Avatar
    Aise

    Hi, since there are several goals met, as the Appendix of the Antitribu or Lore of the Bloodlines book, you will remove these from main text, so you have more space to put material that you had not thought to put at first, or will remain as is?
    Congratulations for another successful Kickstarter!

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      Nothing will be removed from Lore of the Clans. Instead, we are adding three appendices covering the Caitiff, antitribu, and Kindred of Note. The rest of the bloodlines material will comprise a new book.

  18. Michael Avatar
    Michael

    I am beyond stoked for Pugmire. I wish I had sheets today to play with. Not to eat like homework,mind you, but gently mangle like a favered toy.

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      I’m hoping to have something for people to play with at Gen Con, assuming I don’t explode from a million projects.

  19. jason Avatar
    jason

    M20 tastes like sweet, sweet Tass, the mages nectar ofcourse which I imagine tastes like Mana..

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      But what does mana taste like?

      1. Jason Avatar
        Jason

        RedBull…mana taste like RedBull

  20. Martin Avatar
    Martin

    Hi. What’s the status of Houses of the moon novel?

  21. Lance Avatar
    Lance

    Uhm…are there some weird errors in the updates?

    Like, last week’s update the MtC Anthology was listed in Redlines but here it’s listed as being in First Draft…? If it’s not an error, I shudder at the idea of the draft being so bad that it regressed back to the First Draft…which shouldn’t be possible.

    Also: goddamn that was fast for nWoD2e on how in comparison to last week, it apparently shot through Redlines and within a week is already at Second Draft.

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      I copied the text directly from Rose’s email. It’s possible it’s just an error.

  22. Gaz Avatar
    Gaz

    Oh so much awesome on the way! Tal’mahe’ra, ghouls, and M20! I just can’t wait!

    And that concept art for Pugmire! I must admit, this game has truly got my intrigued. My girlfriend (a huge dog-lover and RPer) and I will definitely be getting this one!

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      Glad to hear it! 🙂

  23. Brendan Carrion Avatar
    Brendan Carrion

    What is the development status of Cavaliers of Mars? There hasn’t been a blog post about it since December and it hasn’t been showing up on the development timeline. I’m looking forward to this line a great deal. I hope there is some good news and it hasn’t been cancelled? Thanks.

  24. Chris Avatar
    Chris

    Eddy,

    As the lead voice currently behind the V20 line, long may it continue. What are your thoughts of KotE and the possibility of a KoTE20? KotEK20 a possibility as well?

    Also would LotB touched on the KotE / KotEK “bloodlines” if the stretch goals were there or what that never even under consideration?

    1. Eddy Webb Avatar

      We’ve talked about both, but I feel both would require a more substantial revision than the V20 line has thus far offered. Some exploration of a revised Kindred of the Ebony Kingdom was done in both V20 Dark Ages and Lore of the Clans, but neither were considered as stretch goals for the Kickstarter campaign.

  25. Andreas Rayne Avatar
    Andreas Rayne

    M20…
    Soooo close…

  26. Hivemnd Avatar
    Hivemnd

    Congrats Eddy. Keep being a good dog er man.

  27. jason Avatar
    jason

    well Eddie, the thing about Mana was depending on who ate it, it tasted different and sort of looked like chewing gum, so maybe juicy fruit or bubble yum or bazooka joe..

  28. jason Avatar
    jason

    And since mage is purple, Grape Gum !

  29. CWNimitz Avatar
    CWNimitz

    Could we see M20 before vacation? I am almost losing hope for core book. And, How long time will physical deluxe book come out if pdf ver. has be done.

  30. Jason Avatar
    Jason

    My speculation on the M20 books, a sort of educated guess if you will. As this occurred to me, BUT going by the past OPP KS books and given M20’s size, i am thinking we will receive the backer pdf (NON Indexed) to go over within the next two weeks. ByJune first. Then OPP takes 2 weeks to let the backers be their third proof and then they take the time to do that and get it indexed and ready for CCP approval. Then the final PDF is released sometime in july with the book being aug/sept/nov and not to mention the other PDF’s on down the pipe like HDYDT ? and the M20 ST screen which is hot on M20’s heels. The rest I would imagine get released later this year/early next year. But this is all speculation and going by OPP’s past, most recently W20 since it alone is sort of similar in size to m20..